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We're with ya, guys! Greetings and thanks, from Sandy Beach, NSW, Australia.

Andrew,

I am truly curious what rationale you hold for being so "anti-whaling" as to take to the seas and get in the way of a perfectly legal enterprise on international waters.

As an omnivore and someone who believes in evolution, I accept the natural reality that some animals eat each other animals. As a human, I find it morally acceptable that we kill and eat other animals. The majority of other humans on this planet agree with me, either intellectually or by their actions. To me, the anti-whalers' argument seems extraordinarily strong on emotion and extraordinarily weak on logic. Most of the Australians who agree with your anti-whaling stance are not vegetarians, so it's in your interest to spread a lie about this non-existent, monolithic species called "the whale" and how it's "endangered". Anyone with a smidgen of knowledge will tell you that some species of whale are indeed endangered, but you and I both know that the Japanese hunt minke whales almost exclusively. The minke is clearly not endangered - the cull rate is way below the rate of rebirth. So what's the problem? Also, we know that the market for whale meat in Japan is shrinking - it's something that mostly older people enjoy - and the youth aren't interested in. The market for whale meat is literally dying. The problem is being solved by demographics, not pirates masquerading as eco-crusaders.

So, Andrew. I don't have an issue with the Japanese or the Norwegians harvesting a whale population that is not endangered. Why do you? What makes a whale more special than a cow, a pig, a fish or a chicken?

Just curious.

Great job. Keep like this!
[]s

Tons of of 'science' packaged up and ready to go

http://www.mcdonalds.com/usa.html

Get real!!!!!!!!

Hello You Brave Whale Protectors...

Do you know how many whales have been killed so far this 'season' and how much longer they are going to be down there?.. Cause they can't be down there forever...

Keep up the great work!

We all know it is commercial whale hunting... When will the IWC and international community so something?

It must be a sobering thought for the crew to stare at those packages and realize the contents were once living, breathing, intelligent mammals, swimming carefree before their very eyes a few days prior...and died a horrible, shocking death to end up eventually on store shelves. With Greenpeace's help, may they be the last to die and end up this way, a money-making product (assuming it sells at all).

I was watching Ocean Defenders video clips and decided to show them to my family. They looked at me like I was a complete oddball then walked away. It was embarrasing. My point is don't be intimmidated by anything the whalers can throw at you. You guys Rock!

Hi,

I am horrified at the Japanese whalers. We are baracking for you guys. Wish I was there.
You are getting heaps of publicity and I have put the stories up on our shopfront window here in Manly, Sydney.
Go get em.

Naomi

Manly Environment Centre

Here in Bethesda, MD, we have just begun to fight. I plan to contaact the media and the Jap embassy. Keep up your good work, but be careful.

I was just thinking, "Finally, a country other than the US is the bad guy!" But then I saw this article about the US using its satellites to spy on Greenpeace on behalf of Japan:

US satellites 'spying' on anti-whaling ships

Looks like you guys are getting all sorts of publicity! Maybe you could paint a message on the deck, something like "Yankee go home"..

Keep up the excellent work!

Andrew, this puts into perspective what the Japanese are actually doing which is plundering the sea. I saw the phrase "harvest without sowing" (perhaps on this website) which truly fits the description of this slaughter. Also the returns are completely out of proportion with the effort expended; masses of profit obtained with barely any effort. The Japanese also have not applied the common philosophical criteria to their actions - viz - "what if everybody does as I do?" (I can't believe that somewhere in Shinto/Buddhism philosophy there isn't something about being kind to dumb animals and not plundering the planet). Imagine if other countries with a "traditional" whaling industry and a few ships and a few harpoons suspended their morality in this way and decided to plunder the Southern Seas for this free catch. The ICR argue that consumption of whale is a centuries-old tradition in Japan, however they don't mention that even in the 1900's the population of Japan was only about 30M whereas now it is approximately 128M. That's a heck of a lot more people wanting to participate in a centuries-old tradition with a food source that has diminished greatly. Secondly, Japan is turning into a beef-eating nation with 405,084 tons of beef exported to Japan in 2005 from Australia alone. The US also exports beef to Japan and according to the CIA website, Japan is one of the largest consumers of fish (and tropical timber), "contributing to the depletion of these resources in Asia and elsewhere." They must be having fish/whale for breakfast and beef for dinner.

Yours in support - Marine

Derek

That is great news re the satellites. They should have footage of the Jap boat circling round and hitting the Artic Sunrise. Just the evidence Greenpeace is looking for to allow them to take this one to court.

Greenpeace made front pages in Melbourne today but unfortunately a poor article which referred to the collision and then talked about how the Japanese government wants to send military aircraft to deal with the situation. No mention of Greenpeace's claim that it was the Japanese boat that did the ramming so unfortunately the article suggests Greenpeace is at fault. So anyone in Melbourne please write to the Age to express your disgust at this sloppy piece of journalism. The protestors down there trying to save the planet deserve better than that.

The Age does not that its going to make things interesting if these planes make for the southern ocean since they would probably need to refuel in Australia. A bit of a test for the government. Do they stand up to their major trading partner or do they cave in and let the whales die? Unfortunately with the government here its anyones guess which way they would go.

Anyway, looks like Greenpeace is ruffling another government's feathers. Keep a watch out for men in "frog" suits carrying limpit mines next time you make port.

Maybe a little scientific surgery on a few Jap whalers aka scientists, may help alleviate our concerns as to their apparent and distinct lack of intelligence. Their actions are nothing short of criminal and real action should be taken - maybe a torpedo or two - find out who can really swim!!!

Well done! and thank you!
I am very grateful for your efforts.

Paul's re your post post above, at least it was on the front page with a continuation on Page 2. Last week whale items were almost invisible in the Age, however I did write and complain and since then the whale items have had more prominence (I am not taking credit, just saying I did complain). More disappointing is that SBS this evening has not mentioned the whale issue (although we do know that Ariel Sharon is now "breathing" - it seems he has been wished back to life). I have complained to SBS too. Thankfully Bob Brown is on the case, see http://www.bobbrown.org.au/600_media_sub.php?deptItemID=1871 also reported on the ABC website as a major headline. Of course we are dealing here with very sensitive issues: Japan is Australia's biggest trading partner. Maybe those of us in Melbourne can get together and have a protest march. Anyone interested, please email me.

Marine
Melbourne

Hi Peter,

So, you have researched and researched and researched and now know where McLibel....sorry.. McDonalds's US website is and you also think wounded animals should suffer for as long as possible!

Have you anything of scientific value to contribute to this debate or are you just going to continue standing in the middle of the road, swearing at passing traffic?!
:-)

James -

John, one of our issue experts saw your post and sent the following, my personal comments follow...

--------

'Perfectly legal'? After the IWC has asked them over 30 times to call it off and has said that they don't need the data it produces? Most recently (June, 2005) the IWC said that it: "STRONGLY URGES the Government of Japan to withdraw its JARPA II proposal or to revise it so that any information needed to met the stated objectives of the proposal is obtained using non-
lethal means.

"... you and I both know that the Japanese hunt minke whales almost exclusively."

So why then are they moving into a hunt of fin whales, listed by
IUCN as endangered? They have already stated that they intend to
increase the size of their hunt for fin whales in 2007 and to add
humpbacks as well. Are you aware that as well as minke whales
they also hunt sperm, Bryde's and sei whales in the name of
'science'

"The minke is clearly not endangered - the cull rate is way below the rate of rebirth. So what's the problem?"

Firstly, there is no valid population estimate for Antarctic minke
whales and recent surveys indicate the Antarctic minke population
is substantially lower than the earlier estimate.

Secondly, what you say was once true for all the whales of the
Antarctic: blue, fin, sei and humpback. And one after another they
were all depleted by commercial whaling. Whaling brings no
conservation benefits to whales and has always destroyed
populations of whales. Why take the chance of restarting it?

"Also, we know that the market for whale meat in Japan is shrinking - it's something that mostly older people enjoy - and the youth aren't interested in. The market for whale meat is literally dying."

We hope you are right. If you are, we will gladly stop doing this exhausting and dangerous work. But the Japanese government is subsidising the whaling industry with millions of dollars a year and the industry is working to establish new markets, especially among the young. And the Government of Japan is also recruiting poor developing countries to the IWC to vote with Japan to overturn the moratorium and resume commercial whaling. Since 2000, 16 counties have joined to vote in lock step with Japan. The huge diplomatic effort involved suggests to us that the Government of Japan is serious about resuming commercial whaling.

- John
--------

My comments...

First, I can't see what your personal eating habits have to do with anything. My favourite food is pizza - but that doesn't really help my argument against commercial whaling, does it?

Also, while I think it is possible to make some good arguments about whales being in some way special - this is not an argument Greenpeace makes. Nor is it Greenpeace's position that whaling is wrong because we should all be vegetarians - although again I think this is a valid line of argument, it just isn't one we're making.

Instead, Greenpeace's position is based purely on the need to leave healthy intact ocean ecosystems for future generations. Whales are only one aspect of this work. Here's an overview of the issues we'll be working on through the course of our 14-month Defending Our Oceans expedition.

There are a lot of other pressing problems facing the world's oceans that we would rather be getting on with, instead of still having to deal with whaling - a largely settled issue. But it would be irresponsible for us not to finish the work started decades ago.

More on Greenpeace's basic arguments against whaling can be found here.

I hope that clears up all your questions. To help us throughout the coming months of our expedition, sign up as an Ocean Defender.

While our efforts in the Gulf Conflict raise eyebrows, so does the work of Greenpeace in our southern oceans. You get more coverage than Iraq (for at least a little while in the media!) I hope your peaceful efforts are not being hampered by renegade whale huggers. They do no good to the cause of saving this planets most respected and over hunted species.
My best wishes go to you and the crew and hopefully the captain of the Nisshin Maru will be prosecuted under International Marine Law...too bad the Australian Government won't send a military presence to protect it's own seaways and protected areas from obvious exploitation!
....And cut their longlines when you find them and protect our sea birds!

Tell me about it. I was sooo looking forward to working on an issue where I could be proud of my government's stance. Unfortunately, I haven't heard even a statement from the Bush administration. The US is party to a number of treaties involved, and is a member of the International Whaling Commission. Plus, as I heard someone say, "if the whales belong to anyone, they belong to everyone". So, it would be more than appropriate for the Bush administration to weigh in - preferably with more than just rhetoric, but even a simple statement would be a start.

And then there's also this">http://weblog.greenpeace.org/oceandefenders/archive/2005/12/an_open_challen.html">this.

Tell your government to help end commercial whaling.

Thanks for that special and excellent response Andrew. Yes this is just the beginning of a year long journey to save not only these magnificent and Loving creatures, ...but to save our planet and all the creatures in it. You all out there had better start reading and understanding what Andrew is trying to tell you. This world is in serious trouble, and it begins inside your heart to end all forms of suffering. Begin now and stay the course with these real heroes of our world. They give it their all to save not only whales, but your children as well. God bless you all to face those that would criticize you in their selfishness. In their blindness, and as you turn the other cheek, somehow they cannot see it is them you serve. God help us to understand...

Huggs ! Andrew and all the GP crews !!

i have talked to my Az senators offices , they seem to be in the know , but are seemingly grand standing ,,

a few things i have knoticed , in the U.S. media , there has not been much news here at least on the U.S. Web news reports ,, just the first one i seen when i first made post to you all !!

there has been in the news an artical aobut a ( presumably, ) EX- U.S. Navy sailor who is supposedly to have killed a Japanise Woman , the artical stated little , and that this administration is more concerned over bases there for the navy as well as being able to for once be able to home base a nucular vessal !!! as i say , not much realy about this was stated ,,

i recieved this Email ,

New Zealand is deeply alarmed about Japan's intentions. Hunting whales
is
like hunting tigers, gorillas or kiwi. New Zealanders regard it as
unjustifiable, and unfortunately it is about to happen on an even
larger
scale.

As you are no doubt aware, this year marks the start of a new
scientific
whaling programme by Japan which will see more than double the number
of
whales killed than under Japan's previous programmes. For the first
time,
the magnificent humpback and fin whales are to be included on Japan's
menu
of scientific study from 2007.

New Zealand has made it explicitly clear to Japan that it can see no
good
scientific reason for its programme. It is entirely possible to study
whale
populations without killing them. Many scientists are doing that all
over
the world right now!

Unfortunately, scientific whaling is legal because the provisions in
the
International Convention on the Regulation of Whaling (IWC) are out of
step
with modern conservation approaches.

New Zealand is actively working to remedy this, and I will make public
a
number of proposals we have been considering shortly.

Thank you for your commitment to marine mammal conservation.

Yours sincerely,

Hon Chris Carter
Minister of Conservation

now ,, my stance to this !!

just where on this earth is that Pannamain ship heading with that load of Whale ,, is it going off into space ,, ( first ship to ever do that that would ever be known of ) ,, is that whale meat , allready to be sent from shore to store , or storage with out any other factors of handleing involved ?? in other means , ,is that load of poached meat ready to be sold in the stores ?? if so ,, i thought that so Called SCIENCE reaserch WAS BARRED from selling product !!

that ship has to make harbor sometime , some where ,, be neet to track that load to the shelves !!

another point ,that i would like to ask ,, there is claim by nations the U.S. included ,that this is RESEARCH ,,, now may i ask , ,what did the whalers put down as a thesis as to what they was seeking in the outcome of this so called REASERCH ??? what is it that in the name of SCIENCE are they trying to prove ?? and did they submit such an document to the IWC ?? and if so ,, what is the outcome ?? or is this SUDO SCIENCE IN THE FULLEST FORM ?????

anotehr aspect is they have hit a ship ,, not once but twice , and both GP ships , out of international maritime laws ,, the vidoe of the Artic Sunrise shows that clearly the fatctory ship could have steerd straight out then make the turn , but it was dilerbate ,, and intentional , even in the video last made of the act ,,even i ( not being on a boat , can see the GP ship making waves off the back of thier ship and the rising of the waves to the backward movement ,, sure am glad no one was hurt,,, they should realy slam the door shut to the captain of the other ships cell door !!

here in the states the news is now mostly the issue over the supreme court nomination and the war , as well as the scandles that are coming out of D.C. but quite silence on the atctions down there sadly !

you all be safe and secure ,, ( and to that other persons post , i am actualy far from a true enviromentalist , i eat my slow elk- beef, and i do come from the oil patches of Wyoming , and as well , worked on ranches ,, ) BUT I AM AGAINST POACHING ! this is the biggest out rageouse form i have ever in my life seen , and right before the nations of the world !! OUTRAGUSE !! DISGUSTING !!

,, hey Prince my Kitten even batted his paws the the poachers ships , and he did give a kitty kiss the infalteables ,, now i have to try to get his mess off my computer screen ,, hey even a kitten can see the truth !!

73's and 88's and safe sailing ,, wish i could get you some more coffee cups there !! i have some ,, butto get them there is a whole other matter ,, i too have to have my coffee !!

Denise AZ !!!

Andrew...please remember that the Japanese whalers are taking home less "science" than they would have if you hadn't been there.
It is frustrating that they've taken any lives at all. But you have saved some through your important work of the past weeks. Hopefully, as the world takes note of your extraordinary efforts, you will save even more by shifting world opinion (including Japanese).
Many, many years ago, Greanpeace changed my mind. I know you're changing minds every day. We're getting there, Andrew.
Thanks for being on the front line.
Kim

Yes, James Waterton, imagine that, human beings (you know, the whales' fellow mammals, both sharing some distant common mammilian ancestor on the evolutionary tree) being outraged by the needless suffering and killing of whales. Have you used any of that precious brain power to imagine what it is like to be on the receiving end of those explosive projectiles? I am just curious. No, no concern for you. Let's see, where have I read such a cold-blooded perspective couched in 'logic' before??? Oh yes, it was the war-crime trial of Adolf Eichmann, a man who could have stood a little emotion as a rudder. Such rational justification he was capable of!Tell me, just who are the 'pirates' anyway? How would you describe the whalers 'looting' the seas of these splendid animals? The japanese have NO right to invade those sactuary waters and rob these animals from their own lives. These wild animals deserve to live out their long lives unmolested.

John the expert:

JOHN'S RESPONSE IN ITALICS

1) I agree that the Japanese are being duplicitous by citing scientific reasons for their catch.

An important point - see below.

However, neither side can muster the numbers for an outright ban. And even if they could, Japan would simply exercise its right as a member of the IWC (and a sovereign nation, to boot) to remove itself from the IWC - just like Iceland did in 1992. Whaling is a perfectly legal enterprise on international waters. Membership of the regulatory body, the IWC, is entirely voluntary. Also, it's perfectly permissable to hunt whales under an objection to the moratorium - which is what Norway has been doing since the moratorium was put in place. Would you rather the Japanese storm out of the IWC, like Iceland did in '92? Because then you couldn't monitor the Japanese whaling industry at all.

Japan has repeatedly threatened to leave the IWC but never does it. If they did it would end their 'scientific' whaling in the Antarctic since they would not longer be able to issue themselves special permits. It would not be possible for Japan to go to the Antarctic to hunt whales without belonging to the only international organization with authority over whales in these waters. As it says in the UN Convention on Law of the Sea, Article 65: "States shall co-operate with a view to the conservation of marine mammals and in the case of cetaceans shall in particular work through the appropriate international organizations for their conservation, management and study."

Norway can hunt whales because it took out a reservation to the moratorium. Japan took out one too but withdrew it in 1987. Once a reservation is withdrawn it cannot be renewed.

2) I am aware that the Japanese hunt whales other than minke - but like I said, the thumping majority of their catch is made up of the minke. The Norwegians hunt minke exclusively. Also, John, you need to look at numbers. The Japanese and Norwegians take about 1000 minkes a year.

They take about 1,000 minke whales a year each (Norway took about 650 last year and has raised the quota to over 1,000 for this year).

It is painfully obvious that, with an international population of minkes standing at somewhere between 700 000 - 1.1 million, even if the Japanese double their cull of minkes to about one thousand a year this is obviously a sustainable cull rate.

There are two different species of whale which are both called minke whales. [The fact the Antarctic minke is a separate species from the Northern hemisphere minke whale was only discovered a few years ago.] You can't just add the two species together. But even if you could, there is currently no agreed estimate for the Antarctic minkes. This is because recent surveys indicate that the abundance of Antarctic minkes is substantially lower than the earlier estimates of 760,000. The IWC's scientists are trying to find out what has produced the difference between the old and new surveys.

The minke population will still continue to grow relatively rapidly. Thus, the level of whaling we see at the moment is going to pose no threat to the wellbeing of the ocean ecosystem.

In fact, the minke population may be declining, even without the cull. We simply do not know because we do not know why the surveys have given different results. Given that we don't know, we should not be hunting them and we certainly should not be increasing the size of the hunt.

Greenpeace should be turning its attention to fishing practices in South East Asia, where ecosystems really are threatened.

I'm sure the fishermen there will be able to point us to somewhere they think is worse. In fact, Greenpeace is opposing destructive fishing methods all over the world and calling for large marine reserves to give fish a chance to recover. Have you read: 'Deep sea fishes qualify as endangered', which appeared in Nature this week (5 Jan 2006). Ocean ecosystems are threatened in a lot of areas.

3) As I mentioned earlier, I do have an objection with whalers taking endangered species. So even though the cull rates of other species of whale like sperm, sei, Bryde's (and humpback, if they do start catching them) is tiny - not breaching 50 caught a year, and with sperm, 10 - I don't support this. Even if the cull rate is effortlessly replenished by the birthrate of 2-3%. The humpback's population is growing quite strongly - as is that of the other whales you mentioned, incidentally.

There are no currently agreed estimates for some of these populations, let alone trends over time, so I don't know how you can say that the populations of all these whales are growing (although I hope you are correct). In the case of humpbacks, where we do know a bit out their recover rates, it is apparent that some populations are recovering well and others are not. These whales exhibit 'site fidelity', they return to the waters where they were born, but they mix when they are on the feeding grounds in the Antarctic. So catching humpbacks in the Antarctic could result in taking whales from one of these vulnerable populations. That why the IWC, when it urged Japan to withdraw this program noted that some humpback whales which will be targeted by JARPA II belong to small, vulnerable breeding populations around small island States in the South Pacific and that even small sakes could have a detrimental effect on the recovery and survival of such populations.

Whale scientists study some humpbacks by using photo ID to track appearance and reproductive success from one year to the other. If the whales being tracked are killed, the research is cut short. That's why the IWC also said it was concerned that JARPA II may have an adverse impact on established long-term whale research projects involving humpback whales.

Once their population has recovered, there is no logical reason why a country shouldn't exploit these populations sustainably. The species we need to worry about is the blue whale - that is truly endangered. It is not exploited, however its population of a couple of thousand still remains static. I got a lot of my info regarding Japanese cull rates from this WWF report. As for whale populations, these numbers are widely available from a number of authoritative sources on the internet. A few seconds of Googling will see you right.

Some sources are more authoritative then others. For population estimates I'd advise you to stick with IWC figures.

4) The argument that "last time we whaled we almost wiped out the populations, so we shouldn't restart" doesn't hold up, I'm afraid.

You need to show why it does not hold up. It is not an isolated instance. In the Antarctic first it was the blue whales, then the fin whales, then the sei whales. Once could have been bad practice (although it is hard to see how they could have interpreted the falling catchs in any other way than as indicating a population decline) but to do it again and again demonstrates a pattern. [See Colin Clarke's classic paper 'The Economics of Overexploitation', Science, early 70s, for an explanation of this.

And let's not forget that whalers have a history of cheating. As you have said, the Japanese government is being duplicitous over the 'scientific hunt. And we now know that Japan's coastal whalers falsified statistics and caught more than their their quota right up to when the moratorium came into effect in 1987.

You and I both know that the reason whales were so rabidly hunted was due to the oil we used to derive from their blubber.

Actually that's not correct. It was at first but when Japan took up pelagic whaling, after a couple of years of just taking oil they shifted to bringing back meat. That was in the 1930. Since then the blue whales, fin whales and sei whales of the Antarctic were all depleted. Japan came late to this - much of the damage was done by Norway and the Uk before Japan arrived, but it was Japan that insisted on continuing the hunt for blue whales, even when the total yearly catch in the Antarctic had fallen to a few hundred. Fin and sei whales were also hunted until they needed protection in order to supply markets for whale meat.

Nowadays, tiny numbers of people enjoy whale meat. Even if whaling was legalised, the market would still be so small as to prohibit the re-endangerment of whales - why catch a whale that no one wants to buy? The size of the market determines how many whales are caught, and that market is infantesimally small. The relatively tiny number of whales currently caught by Iceland, Norway and Japan is testament to that fact. And, as I noted before, likely to shrink further over the years, due to the objections that many young people have against whaling in countries that still practice it.

I hope you are right. But the Japanese whaling establishment is keen to reverse this trend and is marketing whale meat to schools and to young people. If whaling is so unimportant, and the market so small, why did Japan submit a proposal to the 2004 IWC meeting to abolish the Southern Ocean whale sanctuary and establish a quota of 2,914 minkes a year?

As for Eric - nice going in wheeling out the Nazi reference. Isn't there some internet debating law stating the first person to use a Nazi analogy loses the argument? You come across as impolite and emotional. I don't see the need to answer your baseless and unsubstantiated rhetoric - I prefer to deal in facts. But, for your edification, here's an interesting article in The Economist.

I saw a picture of the Japanese transport ship with "Whale Meat" painted on the back! That was so cool! You should paint more of their ships!

I'd like to join in the debate, but mmm MMMM, that 'research' looks delicious!

...as for Eric, ...thank God you have emotions instead of empty rhetoric.
...as for you James, it's too bad everything is numbers to you, and that you can't see the needless suffering of even one creature. I suppose you feel the same way for the children in Iraq. As long as it's acceptable numbers, their suffering should mean nothing right? I hope someday you actually get to feel something James. ...and let's not carry this on personally here, ...if you want to talk to me, you can reach me at the email I've provided here.
Thanks Eric for this beautiful Love and passion for life inside you.